The sermon yesterday was fairly relevant to me, but I'll admit to not being terribly comfortable walking in the door. There weren't many people there and it wasn't exactly the "hiding in a crowd" experience I was looking for.
There's no "moral" to my story right now. There's no "and I prayed about it and it was all OK" for me right now. It's doubt, fear, discomfort, and some small amount of pain too.
The church I belonged to for many years is one that has been no stranger to discontent and turmoil. I don't really want to be there specifically, but it was a place to start I thought.
Before I could leave, though, two people were pushing me. Hard. Not gentle "it's nice to see you" but "are you coming back?" and "are you staying?" type stuff. I feel way too fragile right now for that kind of pressure. I want to go, I want to be with God, I want to fellowship, and I want to be quiet in Him. I want, mostly, to be left to find my way right now.
I'm frustrated, and turned off.
But I'm not put off. Next week I'm going to try a church that has been weighing on my mind and urging at me for a while now. Until then, I'm going to start reading my Bible again. Cover to cover. Quietly. Reverently. Really.
Hi Laura,
ReplyDeleteI have also read the bible from beginning to end. And in doing so, I had hoped that it would give me a better understanding of God and that it would also allow me to become closer to God.
But in all honesty, I was left with more questions than answers. I do believe that there is a creator of the universe(God) but I don't believe that the bible or any other religious text that I have read has all the answers as to what God truly is or what our true purpose is here on earth.
Actually, I believe that the universe and God's role in this universe are much more complicated than my brain can comprehend.
I don't aim to discourage you from getting closer to God via religion because religion can sometimes bring a great peace of mind to some people and it can truly enrich some peoples lives.
So, for what it is worth you might also find the role that "entheogens" such as the "amainta mushroom" and the "ayahuasca" plant and other entheogenic plants played on the origins of religion. The Dead Sea scrolls are an interesting read as well.
You might be surprised as to what you learn.
-Farmboy
I'm probably not doing a great job of explaining it right now (too emotional) but I want to find God for myself. I've become rather disillusioned with religion as an institution so to speak. However, on some level I also recognize that I need some form of fellowship and some form of organization in my life (with regards to religion).
ReplyDeleteSo I'm not sure how it all fits together. I don't really even know where or how I fit in.
I've seen up close and personal how other people have hurt some of the people I love all in the name of "religion". So aside from just the "who is God" and those related questions, there's so much rattling around.
Will have to check out the amainta mushroom and the other things you mention.
Ps - thank you for the thought provoking comment.
ReplyDeleteYou are welcome.
ReplyDeleteAnd I can certainly understand your need to find God on your own. Actually, I think that is the best way because in many cultures people are taught and in some instances they are even told what to believe in regards to religion from childhood.
So, some people never even get a chance to consider that there may be more to God than what is writing down in religious texts.
And for what it's worth, in my experience, sometimes even when a person wasn't brought up in a religious environment there are still some people that will be drawn to religion because they feel alone in the world.
And sometimes when you join a church that loneliness will go away because you may feel loved by God or possibly you may even feel loved by the church members themselves. But sometimes it doesn't always work out that way because the type of love that you found wasn't the type of love that you were really seeking.
Everybody wants to feel loved. And for some people, finding God through religion will proved them with that love but for others it will not.
Darn.... I can't believe that I just wrote that!!! I normally don't even write on blogs. I don't know what's gotten into me today!!! Maybe all this hot weather is finally getting to me!!!
Ps - You might find the link down bellow interesting. It will take you to a University of Hawaii webpage entitled "Mushrooms and Religion: Psilocybe, Conocybe, Stropharia, Panaeolus, Copelandia, etc."
ReplyDeletehttp://www.botany.hawaii.edu/faculty/wong/bot135/lect20b.htm
I tried to reply earlier but blogger wouldn't let me in. I love that. :) I'm totally over summer... can't breathe.
ReplyDeleteI have grown up in an environment where belonging to a church is expected - and I've never felt like I truly belonged. I am struggling to separate (in my mind) the love and the Word of God from organized religion, in order to find Him myself. I'm not sure where that will eventually put me with regards to attending church. I've never really felt quite like I fit in.
Lots and lots of things to roll around in my mind at the moment.
Interesting link - I'll have to sit down and really pay attention. :)
I can relate. I also grew up in an environment where you were expected to belong to a church and I never felt like fit in either.
ReplyDeleteAnd in my case, trying to fit in never really worked because I was trying to be somebody that I wasn't. And that wasn't fun because I am not an actor.
I guess that it's human nature to want to fit in and feel like you belong. But if your viewpoints are different from that of most peoples then it can make things rather difficult sometimes.
Gosh, when I read that back to myself that last paragraph sounds kind of sad. So, let me try that again.
On the bright side they say there is somebody for everybody so I guess there are people that share similar views on God and religion as you do. But unfortunately those people might live in the northern most areas China or some other obscure place like that. :)
I am just kidding about that!!!
Also, I know that it must seem strange that I keep sending you info about entheogens. And it probably seems as though I have sabotaged your blog (that was not my intention). So, I won't bother you any further after this post.
ReplyDeleteBut I sure do wish that someone would have taken the time to have shared this info with me many years ago. This info has allowed me to have a different viewpoint of religion than I had previously. The use of entheogens by the early religious and spiritual culture sure filled in a lot of the missing blanks for me in regards to religion. Plus for me, it has also helped to explain a lot of the "mysticism" that surrounds most religions.
Also, it amazes me and quite honestly it even saddens me that the vast majority of religious people or for that matter, the general population has never even heard the term entheogen and thus most people are not even aware that early religious cultures used hallucinogenic inducing plants (entheogens) to get "closer to God".
Nowadays, people would probably refer to that activity as "getting high" or "getting stoned out of your mind". But unfortunately a few thousand years ago when religion began people didn't understand what effect these entheogenic plant based compounds were really having on their bodies.
The people of that time had very little scientific knowledge so more than likely they just thought that what they were experiencing were not hallucinations but rather they probably thought that what they were experiencing was very real and that "God was talking to them" or that they were just having a spiritual experience of some kind. Hey, if I had been living during that time that's probably what I would have thought.
Also, I just wanted to mention that there were numerous other entheogenic plants that were used by many of the early religious and spiritual cultures other than the amanita mushroom and ayahuasca.
John Hopkins even performed a study using a plant based entheogen called psilocybin. The researchers discovered that psilocybin caused people to experience "mystical" spiritual experiences and hallucinations. And this was the same stuff that some of the early religious cultures were consuming.
The John Hopkins press release can be read on the link down bellow.
http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Press_releases/2006/07_11_06.html
Also, I noticed that in a previous post of mine I misspelled the name of that mushroom. It should have been spelled "Amanita". There is a photo of the Santa Claus colored mushroom on the webpage down bellow. That article is also a interesting read.
http://www.botany.hawaii.edu/faculty/wong/bot135/lect20a.htm
Ps - I believe that there is most likely a creator of the universe(God) but I think that God is probably more complicated than I can comprehend. Though I do have some ideas!!!
*sigh* Blogger won't let me log in again as myself. Whatever.
ReplyDeleteSomehow the spam blocker caught this (and one other, but they were close enough I only published this one).
You're not hijacking - don't go away. :) I haven't promoted this particular blog and I won't, but it's nice to have different views presented for me to think about. I appreciate your viewpoint and the dialogue, regardless of whether or not we're in fundamental agreement. :) I've never been a particularly judgemental Christian, and am certainly not argumentative.
Speaking of halucinogenics, have you ever read any of the Sword of Truth books by Terry Goodkind? When the main characters visit the Mud People they put a frog on their chests that emit an halucinogenic substance in order to commune with the spirits of their ancestors. And ok, so that's fiction, but interesting concept nonetheless.
btw... I believe that God did indeed create the universe and I believe in the Bible as being Holy and inspired, and believe in what it teaches. My issues come from the execution of these principles by the general church body and some of their interpretation. But there have indeed been some dark hours as of late where even the simplest of "is He there" concepts have been challenged. But I think it is an awesome growth opportunity for me.
Part 1
ReplyDeleteI am sorry that I haven't responded back sooner but for some reason Blogger wouldn't allow me to post a comment yesterday and for most of the day today........ so frustrating!!!! So, if you are reading this then maybe I got a little help from someone in heaven above!! If so, then apparently, someone or something wanted you to read this comment. :) So, please let me know if this post of mine dramatically alters the course of your life in some way or if you have some sort of life altering epiphany as a result of reading my comment. :)
Please excuse my silliness because for some reason or the other, I am feeling extra silly today!!! Do you ever have days like that? What can I say, after hours of finally trying to post a comment and then finally being able to post that comment, well I felt this overwhelming need to celebrate and be silly!!
Also, thank you for inviting me to stay around because I was worried that I was "hogging" the comment section because it seems as though most of my posts are about a half a mile long!!!!!! Plus I didn't want to come across as being someone that was trying to impose his religious viewpoints upon you. My views on the origins of religion probably wouldn't be welcomed by most people so it's very refreshing to know that you are such an open minded person. I also try to be non judgmental in regards to a person's religious beliefs. Actually, one of my dearest friends is a deeply devoted Christian and we get along wonderfully. I don't impose my views on them and they don't impose their views on me. Even though, I don't share the same religious code as that of my friend we do seem too share the same moral code. And in our case sharing the same moral code is more important to us than sharing the same religious code.
Personally, I don't really consider myself to be a religious person(or at least not by what most people's standards of being religious means) but I am also not an atheist. So, maybe I could describe myself as spiritual. Though, I don't practice any type of spiritual activities or rituals. So, I don't even know if spiritual would be a good word to describe me. But I do believe that there is a creator of the universe (a God) because in my opinion things just seem to be a little to perfect for there not to be a creator. And I also believe that God is playing a role here on earth. And I do try to apply many of the moral code aspects of the bible into my daily life.
Let's see..... I am not exactly religious or spiritual per se but I am also definitely not an atheist either. So, where does that leave me? I guess that leaves me in the "I don't fit in" category. *sigh*
Apparently, my "half a mile long" comment was too long for Bloggers likening so I had to make it a two parter. Heck, I might even have to make a trilogy out of it.
ReplyDeleteNow without any further udo, here's Part 2 :)
Anyway, I was raised a Christian but through the years, the more I read, researched and learned about religion my views about religion have changed somewhat. But I still do my best to respect people's religious beliefs. And in all honesty, for some people, I think that religion can bring happiness into their lives and a remarkable sense of well being. So, I am a firm believer that religion can potentially bring many positive aspects to a persons life. Though, in some cases religious beliefs can also be a source of conflict e.g., the middle east.
I also live near the Mennonites (Amish like) and you would be hard pressed to find happier people than them. And you would also be hard pressed to find a group of people that are as kind and generous as they have been to me. Although, I am not sure if their kindness and happiness is due to the religious code that they live by or if it is due to a personal moral code that they live by. Either way they are good people!!!
In my opinion, religious codes and moral codes aren't always one in the same. Again, take the middle east for example. The different religious codes seem to cause quite alot of turmoil in that area. But if they all shared a similar moral code then I wonder if things would be much less hostile in that area??
And by the way, speaking of all the different religions, when I first started to really think about the origins of religion I asked myself this question, "Which religion has it completely right? The Christians? The Jewish? The Mormons? The Catholics? The Muslims?" If only one of them has it right then by default wouldn't all of the rest have it wrong??
And then that lead me to this question, "Which is more likely?? All of them being correct?? Or are all of them being wrong (or at least partially wrong)???" The Jewish don't believe that Jesus was the son of God. The Mormons claim that Jesus is coming back to Missouri. The Muslims believe that if a man dies in the name of Allah then he will be rewarded with 40 virgins when he enters heaven. Well, what about the Islamic women? What do they have waiting for them when they go to heaven? Do they just get to set there and watch their husbands frolic around with the 40 virgins? If that's true, then that doesn't sound all that fair to the women/wives of those men. Silly things like that in religion are a huge turn off for me!!! Because surely, that isn't the word of God!!!
And no, unfortunately I have not read any of the Sword of Truth books. So, like any good blog follower I immediately googled that book and it sounds like something that I would be interested in because I like science fiction. Yes, this farm boy is kind of nerdy!!
Actually, when you think about it, quite often science fiction books, movies and television shows have religious/spiritual elements to them e.g, The Matrix. Legend of the Seeker, Stargate and etc.. And I like shows like that. Again, that's probably due to the inner nerd in me!!!
Sorry - got kind of tied up with my other blog (and work, and blogger hates me) but I'll give some thought and respond over the weekend. :) Lots of good stuff to chew on. I've actually crafted like 2 responses and had to delete them.
ReplyDeleteWith a God that is supposed to be all knowing and all powerful, why wouldn't he reach out to His people in different ways? What if all of the various religions are mostly right? I've never truly been convinced that He wouldn't speak to each of us in a different way. So yeah, I'm not discounting the possibility that other people won't be in Heaven.
ReplyDeleteI read some books in college that really resonated in me. Crud, now I can't remember who wrote them. But the premise of the books was that there was danger in being OVERLY conservative, overly liberal, or overly legalistic. The concept was that you missed out on God if you were hung up on things like... turning away His people because they had tattoos and such. Very eye opening.
Now I've got to go try to remember which books those were. They were a turning point for me in how I love other people.
Laura, your comments are always interesting!!
ReplyDeleteAnd it does seem as though there are many different and separate paths in which a person can follow in order to find or get closer to God e.g., the Christian path, the Mormon path, the Islamic path, the Catholic path, the Jewish path, the Hinduism path, the Buddhism path, the Shamanism path and etc.
So, maybe God is reaching out to people in different ways through all of those similar but still distinctly different religions.
But what happens to a person when they don't follow one of those religious pathways mentioned above but instead he or she follows their own path in hopes that they will get closer to God? Is God reaching out to them in a different way? I hope so, because if not then I am in trouble!!
And therein lies the scary part. One thing that most modern religions seem to have in common is basically you have to do something or you won't go to Heaven, receive your reward, whatever. Personally, I don't want to leave it up to chance. The one thing I see that seems to be a recurring theme in most organized religions is belief in Him.
ReplyDeleteThere is, I think, a distinct difference in believing that God exists, and believing *in* him.
I also think that if God is reaching out to someone (and I believe that he reaches out to ALL of us in some way because He wants a relationship with us) that the person has to accept the gift - accept Him, and accept his love. I don't even know that it matters if I, or you, or anyone else embraces organized religion, but rather embraces Him.
That should read "Another thing I see that seems to be a recurring theme in most organized religions is belief in Him". Fingers go too fast.
ReplyDeleteI had never really thought of it that way but it does seems as though all of the main organized religions do have that one common theme..... a belief in "him". So, you have touched upon something that I had never really thought of.
ReplyDeleteBut why do things always have to be so complicated??!!! *Sigh*
God sure did create a very interesting world for us to live in!!! I guess that life wouldn't be nearly as interesting if everything were so simple and easily explained.
Oh well, I am off to go ponder on what you said a while!! And thanks for making that comment because I think that it can be useful to get an other person's view point.
That should have read "organized religions do have that as a common theme..... a belief in Him". Fingers go too slow.
ReplyDeleteDarn!! I finally found a blog that is discussing entheogens and their asociation with the origin of religion only to learn that this blog is no longer active. Oh well, if anybody happens to find this blog by accident like I did then you might want to take a look at this soon to begin John Hopkins study.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.bpru.org/spiritual-practice/more.html
John Hopkins School of Medicine is recruting people to join a study that involves ingesting an entheogenic mushroom to see if will alters your spiritual awareness.
Oh, and by the way I would also highly recommend that anyone interested in the association between entheogens and religion read the book, "DMT: The Spirit Molecule". Or watch the documentary film, "DMT: The Spirit Molecule."
ReplyDeleteDMT is a very potent psychedelic compound that is naturally produced by the pineal gland in tiny amounts. But DMT can also be found in much larger quantities in various hallucenogenic inducinng plants (entheogenic plants).
The use of plants that were high in DMT seemed to be favored by many people during the early days of the formation of religion.